Good day
 

 

 I just want to know about what "Radial Curve" in a saxophone mouthpiece mean?
 

 

 How to calculate this?
 

 

 

 Thank you

A radial curve is a section of a circle that the table is tangent to. How to calculate, there are several ways. But if you don't want to do the geometry yourself I think there is a spreadsheet in the files area here that you can use.

What is the filename of the spreadsheet?  

 I only saw one for the clarinet.
 

 

 How about for the saxophone?

There is a radial curve spreadsheet in the Methods file section.   You can also use any elliptical spreadsheet if you set the aspect ratio to 1.


> On May 18, 2016, at 8:22 AM, warren927736@... [MouthpieceWork] <MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
> 
> What is the filename of the spreadsheet? 
> 
> 
> I only saw one for the clarinet.
> 
> 
> How about for the saxophone?
> 

Oh. Just checked it 

 

 Is this the file: "AD Elliptical Facing Curve"? 

Try the one called "Facing Curve".   Simple arc = radial.

      From: "warren927736@... [MouthpieceWork]" <MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com>
 To: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com 
 Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2016 1:47 PM
 Subject: Re: [MouthpieceWork] Re: Radial Curve
   
    Oh. Just checked it

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Got it.. 

 

 Ok.
 

 

 So how to use this one???
 

 

 

 Thanks

Instructions are listed in the spreadsheet.   What are your feelers and facing curve measurements?

> On May 19, 2016, at 7:27 AM, warren927736@yahoo.com [MouthpieceWork] <MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
> 
> Got it..
> 
> 
> 
> Ok.
> 
> 
> So how to use this one???
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks
> 

Ok 

 Is that the correct file? 
 

 The instruction stated here is "Inputs in Blue"
 

 

 What does this mean???
 

 Where will I put the data I gathered/measured?
 

 

 My feelers are (in mm):
 

 .05
 .25
 .50
 .60
 .75
 .86
 1.00
 1.27
 2.00
 3.00

 

Ok ok 

 

 It says here "inputs in blue"
 

 

 Is this the one (encircled) referring to
 

 

 I have .05 .25 .50 .60.75 .86 1.00 1.27 2.00 and 3.00
 

 

 Should the feelers be in inches or in mm?

I will show you in the spreadsheet if you list your glass gauge readings next to your feelers.

The spreadsheet is set up for inch feelers but it will work with mms.   You need your tip opening too in mms.

The feeler set goes in the F column.   Your glass reading go in the Spec column.

> On May 19, 2016, at 10:56 AM, warren927736@... [MouthpieceWork] <MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
> 
> [Attachment(s) from warren927736@... [MouthpieceWork] included below]
> Ok
> 
> 
> Is that the correct file? 
> 
> The instruction stated here is "Inputs in Blue"
> 
> 
> What does this mean???
> 
> Where will I put the data I gathered/measured?
> 
> 
> My feelers are (in mm):
> 
> .05
> 
> .25
> 
> .50
> 
> .60
> 
> .75
> 
> .86
> 
> 1.00
> 
> 1.27
> 
> 2.00
> 
> 3.00
> 
> 
> 

Hi 

 

 

 There I already placed my readings on the spec area
 

 

 

 Feelers are in inches already, so as the Tip opening
 

 

 My readings is on a blank soprano sax mouthpiece. Can that be used?
 

 

 I encircled some numbers. What do they mean?
 

 

 What is really the relevance of this data on mouthpiece refacing? 
 

 

 Thank you so much

I uploaded a new spreadsheet with your sop sax mouthpiece facing curve data.

You did not specify a tip opening so I guessed .095" since it matches the rest of your data.  You can plug in your own measurement.  This is a very large tip opening for sop sax.  Like Steve Lacey large.

Your curve also looks too curved to me.  More than a radial curve would have at this tip opening.  The reed has a hard time bending this much so this curve would blow with a lot of resistance.


> On May 19, 2016, at 10:29 PM, warren927736@yahoo.com [MouthpieceWork] <MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
> 
> [Attachment(s) from warren927736@... [MouthpieceWork] included below]
> Hi
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There I already placed my readings on the spec area
> 
> 
> 
> Feelers are in inches already, so as the Tip opening
> 
> 
> My readings is on a blank soprano sax mouthpiece. Can that be used?
> 
> 
> I encircled some numbers. What do they mean?
> 
> 
> What is really the relevance of this data on mouthpiece refacing? 
> 
> 
> Thank you so much
> 

Thanks for that Sir 

 

 The glass gauge I used is a mm*2 gauge. 
 

 

 As for the tip opening I got a reading of .061"
 

 

 May I know what is the relevance of this data (the radial facing curve) to the process?
 

 

 When is this table being used? On plotting the data gathered or during refacing process? 
 

 

 Thank you

.061" sounds like a reasonable tip opening.

But for a tip of .061", you should have a glass reading for your .079" = 2 mm feeler gauge.   This feeler is too thick to fit in a .061" percent ip opening.   You have a 4.2 glass gauge reading listed for the .079" feeler.

This makes me question all of your readings.  It could be that the table of your mouthpiece is convex (not flat).  The glass gauge and tip opening gauge may be rocking on the table depending on where you put your thumb.

The relevance of comparing your readings to smooth mathematical curves can show where you need to improve your facing.  Smoother curves play better than irregular ones.

But you need to get good measurements that make sense before you can analyze them.


> On May 20, 2016, at 1:36 PM, warren927736@... [MouthpieceWork] <MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
> 
> Thanks for that Sir
> 
> 
> 
> The glass gauge I used is a mm*2 gauge. 
> 
> 
> As for the tip opening I got a reading of .061"
> 
> 
> May I know what is the relevance of this data (the radial facing curve) to the process?
> 
> 
> When is this table being used? On plotting the data gathered or during refacing process? 
> 
> 
> Thank you
> 

Oh... 

 

 

 Sorry I forgot to put a .034 feeler.
 

 

 Pardon me for that.
 

 

 Here's the new file 
 

 

 Sorry I overlooked some things

 

 I encircled some numbers in the files
 

 How would you get the R and M and the 0 part in the feeler gauge?
 

 

 

 Thank you

You said "The relevance of comparing your readings to smooth mathematical curves can show where you need to improve your facing.  Smoother curves play better than irregular ones."

 

 

 Does the smooth mathematical curve are the ones in blue? 
 

 Is that the what you mean by the "smooth curve"?
 

 

 Thank you 

Sorry, I need to take a break on this.   Maybe someone else can help you.

> On May 20, 2016, at 10:52 PM, warren927736@... [MouthpieceWork] <MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
> 
> You said "The relevance of comparing your readings to smooth mathematical curves can show where you need to improve your facing.  Smoother curves play better than irregular ones."
> 
> 
> Does the smooth mathematical curve are the ones in blue? 
> 
> Is that the what you mean by the "smooth curve"?
> 
> 
> Thank you 
> 

Sorry for being annoying sir.. 

 

 

 Just a newbie here curious on the "how-to's" of refacing
 

 

 

 Thank you

Have you watched all the videos on YouTube? This should be really helpful and answer many questions.

I am also fairly new, but the Key in the graph shows you what your measurements are, and then has diamonds where it should be.  The actual curve shown is just a best fit curve for the data input into the chart.

If you're having trouble getting your head around that particular spreadsheet, make your own. Even if you don't end up using it, the exercise will help clarify your thinking on the subject. To begin: We're talking about a radial curve -- a portion of a circle, to which the table is tangent. How I made my first radial facing curve spreadsheet years ago is the following: X axis is the table.
 The tip is on the Y axis
 feeler gauges are then points along Y
 circle's radius, facing length, and tip opening are variables
 use algebra, geometry, and trigonometric identities to get the equations to generate the X coordinates, which will be your glass gauge numbers.
 Have the spreadsheet graph both the generated curve and another curve from your own glass gauge numbers so you can see the difference
 

 It may take a few hours but you should have a clearer picture in your head of what you're trying to do, and have a clearer understanding of Keith's spreadsheet as well.
 

 hope that helps

ok  

 It's getting a bit clearer now.
 

 you said "use algebra, geometry, and trigonometric identities to get the equations to generate the X coordinates, which will be your glass gauge numbers". 
 

 Is there any formula for that? 
 

 

 I attached a file along with this message. In it I have questions that I seek to be answered.
 

 I hope you can help me understand it..
 

 If you may, you can also show the table/computation you did on your own. 
 

 

 Thanks 

Is there a formula? There are a few that will get you there. I've told you the broad strokes of how to generate one of them. I'm not going to tell you exaclty what it is because that would mean digging out an old computer or doing the work again, and besides, you're better off doing it yourself anyway. Seriously, putting in the work to figure this out will leave you a much better understanding of the subject. 

 I can't really give you much help on Keith's spreadsheet, I've never used it, but most of it is self explanatory. That said, if you are wondering what formula is used to generate any cell in an excel spreadsheet, just select the cell and look in the input bar in between the sheet and the menu items.
 

 Oh by the way, there's an error in my earlier post. I said "radius, tip opening, and facing length" are inputs. For any given facing length and tip opening there is only one radius that fits both points. So only tip opening and facing length are variable, they'e enough information to find any point on the facing.

ok 

 

 thank you