Hi there

I've been observing and comparing windows from different HR tenor pieces, trying to understand how they work to the overall sound of the mpc. It is said that long windows favor the low register, but too long windows makes the mpc loose the tonal core (see the article of Tom Ridenour about clarinet mouthpiece facings)... is there a direct link between window legth and "play room" in the lower register? Are there well-known combinations in the choices of window lengths/side rail widths?



      

On sax, once a widow gets long enough, it does not matter much, if at all, if 
you make it longer.  If there is a large blunt wall, undercutting it will help 
response perhaps more than lengthening the widow.

Long facings will help the lower register sax response much more than a long 
window will.  


Side rail width is a factor more near the tip of the reed.  Rail overhang that 
is wider than the reed is not a huge deal.  Response might be a little better 
when they are trimmed to the reed width.  I think it is also easier to ceter up 
the reed.  Thinning the rails from the inside so that the window gets wider will 
change the sound and response more.  The sound get bigger and a little darker 
IMO.

 
Mojo Mouthpiece Work LLC
2925 Crane St., Vineland, NJ 08361 
Paypal to sabradbury79@... 
Check out: http://www.MojoMouthpieceWork.com
...and: http://www.facebook.com/mojomouthpiecework




________________________________
From: pascal <night000cruiser@...>
To: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, October 11, 2010 2:31:32 PM
Subject: [MouthpieceWork] Mouthpiece windows

  
Hi there

I've been observing and comparing windows from different HR tenor pieces, trying 
to understand how they work to the overall sound of the mpc. It is said that 
long windows favor the low register, but too long windows makes the mpc loose 
the tonal core (see the article of Tom Ridenour about clarinet mouthpiece 
facings)... is there a direct link between window legth and "play room" in the 
lower register? Are there well-known combinations in the choices of window 
lengths/side rail widths?
  




      

I’ve never tried undercutting a long widow. Sounds like it could be fun.

Tony F.

 

From: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com [mailto:MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Keith Bradbury
Sent: Friday, 15 October 2010 1:20 AM
To: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [MouthpieceWork] Mouthpiece windows

 

  

On sax, once a widow gets long enough, it does not matter much, if at all, if you make it longer.  If there is a large blunt wall, undercutting it will help response perhaps more than lengthening the widow.

 


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"Keith Bradbury" kwbradbury@... kwbradbury wrote:

Long facings will help the lower register sax response much more than a long
> window will.
>

Have you happened to notice whether Rico mouthpieces (Graftonite, Metalite)
have short facings, out of the box? I thought low register response (and
jumping back and forth between octaves) were their main shortcomings.

Joe

I have a few of these I just measured.  I purchased them in 2001-02:

TS M11: 54/53
TS B7: 50/51
AS C5: 41.5/40.5
AS C5: 42
AS C5: 41.5/40.5
AS B5: 41.5/40.5
AS A5: 40
AS B7 (glossy finish): 44/44.5
Cl B3: 36/35
Cl C7: 34.5

So I would not call them short.  The M11 is very long.  

 
Mojo Mouthpiece Work LLC
2925 Crane St., Vineland, NJ 08361 
Paypal to sabradbury79@... 
Check out: http://www.MojoMouthpieceWork.com
...and: http://www.facebook.com/mojomouthpiecework




________________________________
From: Joe Castleman <a.hominid@...>
To: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, October 15, 2010 11:54:51 AM
Subject: [MouthpieceWork] Re: Mouthpiece windows

  
"Keith Bradbury" kwbradbury@... kwbradbury wrote:


Long facings will help the lower register sax response much more than a long
>window will. 
>
Have you happened to notice whether Rico mouthpieces (Graftonite, Metalite) have 
short facings, out of the box? I thought low register response (and jumping back 
and forth between octaves) were their main shortcomings.

Joe




      

Also a TS M9: 52/53
 
Mojo Mouthpiece Work LLC
2925 Crane St., Vineland, NJ 08361 
Paypal to sabradbury79@... 
Check out: http://www.MojoMouthpieceWork.com
...and: http://www.facebook.com/mojomouthpiecework




________________________________
From: Joe Castleman <a.hominid@...>
To: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, October 15, 2010 11:54:51 AM
Subject: [MouthpieceWork] Re: Mouthpiece windows

  
"Keith Bradbury" kwbradbury@... kwbradbury wrote:


Long facings will help the lower register sax response much more than a long
>window will. 
>
Have you happened to notice whether Rico mouthpieces (Graftonite, Metalite) have 
short facings, out of the box? I thought low register response (and jumping back 
and forth between octaves) were their main shortcomings.

Joe




      

I picked up a few new Rico Graftonite tenor/alto mouthpieces earlier this year and just measured them. I came up with the following measurements for the tenor ones:

Rico Graftonite tenor (they are referred to as models A5 and A7 even though they are tenor pieces):
Tenor A5: .095" tip, 46L
Tenor A7: .105" tip, 48L

These to me seem like pretty medium facings for tenor, with the A5 .095" tip model's facing being fairly short. If I measure the alto ones soon I'll try to add them to this list.

--- In MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com, Keith Bradbury <kwbradbury@...> wrote:
>
> Also a TS M9: 52/53
>  
> Mojo Mouthpiece Work LLC
> 2925 Crane St., Vineland, NJ 08361 
> Paypal to sabradbury79@... 
> Check out: http://www.MojoMouthpieceWork.com
> ...and: http://www.facebook.com/mojomouthpiecework
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________
> From: Joe Castleman <a.hominid@...>
> To: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Fri, October 15, 2010 11:54:51 AM
> Subject: [MouthpieceWork] Re: Mouthpiece windows
> 
>   
> "Keith Bradbury" kwbradbury@... kwbradbury wrote:
> 
> 
> Long facings will help the lower register sax response much more than a long
> >window will. 
> >
> Have you happened to notice whether Rico mouthpieces (Graftonite, Metalite) have 
> short facings, out of the box? I thought low register response (and jumping back 
> and forth between octaves) were their main shortcomings.
> 
> Joe
>

Actually, just got around to checking out the altos. These were not as even at the break point as the tenors. For a few alto Graftonite "A" model pieces, I got:

Graftonite alto A5: .080" tip opening, 42/40L
Graftonie alto A7: .090" tip opening, 45/43.5L
Graftonie alto A7: .090" tip opening 45.5/43.5L

Interesting to note that their "7" is about .010" more than most people would consider a "7", I believe Meyer's chart says 7 = .081", and same goes for the "5" tip piece. The gauges slip down from the 44 range on the left side to the 45/45.5 range with the slightest amount of pressure on the facing gauges, leading me to believe that the intended target for the break point on the .090" tip opening A7 piece might possibly actually be more like 44 on the glass gauge. Some really good playing alto pieces in the .080" tip range have also measured at 42 on the glass gauge for me, leading me to guess that the intended target for these Graftonite A5 .080" tip pieces might've actually been 42 on both sides. Who knows.

--- In MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com, "mattmarantz86" <mattmarantz86@...> wrote:
>
> I picked up a few new Rico Graftonite tenor/alto mouthpieces earlier this year and just measured them. I came up with the following measurements for the tenor ones:
> 
> Rico Graftonite tenor (they are referred to as models A5 and A7 even though they are tenor pieces):
> Tenor A5: .095" tip, 46L
> Tenor A7: .105" tip, 48L
> 
> These to me seem like pretty medium facings for tenor, with the A5 .095" tip model's facing being fairly short. If I measure the alto ones soon I'll try to add them to this list.
> 
> --- In MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com, Keith Bradbury <kwbradbury@> wrote:
> >
> > Also a TS M9: 52/53
> >  
> > Mojo Mouthpiece Work LLC
> > 2925 Crane St., Vineland, NJ 08361 
> > Paypal to sabradbury79@ 
> > Check out: http://www.MojoMouthpieceWork.com
> > ...and: http://www.facebook.com/mojomouthpiecework
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ________________________________
> > From: Joe Castleman <a.hominid@>
> > To: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Fri, October 15, 2010 11:54:51 AM
> > Subject: [MouthpieceWork] Re: Mouthpiece windows
> > 
> >   
> > "Keith Bradbury" kwbradbury@ kwbradbury wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > Long facings will help the lower register sax response much more than a long
> > >window will. 
> > >
> > Have you happened to notice whether Rico mouthpieces (Graftonite, Metalite) have 
> > short facings, out of the box? I thought low register response (and jumping back 
> > and forth between octaves) were their main shortcomings.
> > 
> > Joe
> >
>

--- In MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com, Joe Castleman <a.hominid@...> wrote:
>
> "Keith Bradbury" kwbradbury@... kwbradbury wrote:
> 
> Long facings will help the lower register sax response much more than a long
> > window will.
> >
> 
> Have you happened to notice whether Rico mouthpieces (Graftonite, Metalite)
> have short facings, out of the box? I thought low register response (and
> jumping back and forth between octaves) were their main shortcomings.
> 
> Joe
>
*** The makers specs for Rico Royal Graftonite are as follows.
Concert Model= A3/A5/A7 (low baffle)
Jazz Model     B3/B5/B7
Rock Model     C3/C5/C7  (High baffle/small chamber)
Alto Model #3 = 70/820
           #5 = 80/858
           #7 = 90/896
Out of the box, they often measure shorter than this and the tables are not always flat. Compared to Link measurements these are longer and I query the suggestion that they cause octave jumping, but I do find an alto C5 I have is unresponsive at the low end with 42 length
Filling in the hollow just behind the tip makes it scream like a Beechler Diamond. 
Eddie. 
Eddie

Sorry, I wasn't clear in my original post. I should have said "and *difficulty
*jumping back and forth between octaves", i.e. I found it difficult to jump
up or, especially, down from one octave to the next.

Could just be me, of course, but this is in comparison to other pieces I've
used.

Thanks again,

Joe

"Edward McLean" ed@... keith29236 wrote:

> *** The makers specs for Rico Royal Graftonite are as follows.
> Concert Model= A3/A5/A7 (low baffle)
> Jazz Model     B3/B5/B7
> Rock Model     C3/C5/C7  (High baffle/small chamber)
> Alto Model #3 = 70/820
>           #5 = 80/858
>           #7 = 90/896
> Out of the box, they often measure shorter than this and the tables are not
> always flat. Compared to Link measurements these are longer and I query the
> suggestion that they cause octave jumping, but I do find an alto C5 I have
> is unresponsive at the low end with 42 length
> Filling in the hollow just behind the tip makes it scream like a Beechler
> Diamond.
> Eddie.
> Eddie
>
>