I recently acquired a 5* M Dukoff Bari mpc. After filling and finishing
the small ding and gouge and bringing the tiprail to match the existing
rail, it squeels. The width is close to 1/32" (.034) . The slight
rollover baffle seems to have a slight concavity very near the inside
edge of the tip rail. I don't know if this is normal for this model of
Dukoff.

Though the inside edge of the tiprail seems to be distinct, could this
angle be off slightly and would bringing the baffling down behind the
inside edge of the tiprail eliminate the squeeling? I do not know if
this mpc has been worked on before I acquired it. I did gauge the side
rails and they are pretty even all the way. The table was concave. I
brought it almost to flat.

Any help would be appreciated.

I would think that taking some material off just below the
tip rail could certainly help with the squealing. Really,
right below the tip rail: make sure that the angle changes
noticeably at the back edge of the tip rail. 

I assume you have tried this with different reeds...An
unbalanced reed can squeak like crazy on a balanced mpc.
And even if the side rails are balanced (unbalanced side
rails are a major cause of this kind of behavior), did you
maintain the curve of the lay correctly?

Toby

--- maddahorn <maddahorn@...> wrote:

> 
> I recently acquired a 5* M Dukoff Bari mpc. After
> filling and finishing
> the small ding and gouge and bringing the tiprail to
> match the existing
> rail, it squeels. The width is close to 1/32" (.034)
> . The slight
> rollover baffle seems to have a slight concavity
> very near the inside
> edge of the tip rail. I don't know if this is normal
> for this model of
> Dukoff.
> 
> Though the inside edge of the tiprail seems to be
> distinct, could this
> angle be off slightly and would bringing the
> baffling down behind the
> inside edge of the tiprail eliminate the squeeling?
> I do not know if
> this mpc has been worked on before I acquired it. I
> did gauge the side
> rails and they are pretty even all the way. The
> table was concave. I
> brought it almost to flat.
> 
> Any help would be appreciated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 

Assuming the tip rail is even now, make sure the baffle is even.  And as Toby suggested, increase the baffle angle a bit.  Make sure your curve is smooth, and doesn't have any high spots, especially in the first 10mm from the tip.
  

--- In MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com, "maddahorn" <maddahorn@...> wrote:
>
> 
> I recently acquired a 5* M Dukoff Bari mpc. After filling and finishing
> the small ding and gouge and bringing the tiprail to match the existing
> rail, it squeels. The width is close to 1/32" (.034) . The slight
> rollover baffle seems to have a slight concavity very near the inside
> edge of the tip rail. I don't know if this is normal for this model of
> Dukoff.
> 
> Though the inside edge of the tiprail seems to be distinct, could this
> angle be off slightly and would bringing the baffling down behind the
> inside edge of the tiprail eliminate the squeeling? I do not know if
> this mpc has been worked on before I acquired it. I did gauge the side
> rails and they are pretty even all the way. The table was concave. I
> brought it almost to flat.
> 
> Any help would be appreciated.
>

thanks for the responses:

Toby, I'm not sure what you mean by maintaining the curve of the lay? Do you mean of the Tip rail? If so, I got it to match my reed tip at the outside of the tip rail but there is a slight variation in the width of the rail along the contour of it's lay...probably +/- .002" from the center to the outside where it meets the side rails. Is this enough to cause squeeling? I wanted to do as little as possible to this mpce, foregoing the possibility of making a mess of the tip rail.Unfortunately sounds like I'm going to have to bite the bullet and drop the baffle a bit behind the tip rail...scary area for me.

Thanks again all.

--- In MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com, <kymarto123@...> wrote:
>
> I would think that taking some material off just below the
> tip rail could certainly help with the squealing. Really,
> right below the tip rail: make sure that the angle changes
> noticeably at the back edge of the tip rail. 
> 
> I assume you have tried this with different reeds...An
> unbalanced reed can squeak like crazy on a balanced mpc.
> And even if the side rails are balanced (unbalanced side
> rails are a major cause of this kind of behavior), did you
> maintain the curve of the lay correctly?
> 
> Toby
> 
> --- maddahorn <maddahorn@...> wrote:
> 
> > 
> > I recently acquired a 5* M Dukoff Bari mpc. After
> > filling and finishing
> > the small ding and gouge and bringing the tiprail to
> > match the existing
> > rail, it squeels. The width is close to 1/32" (.034)
> > . The slight
> > rollover baffle seems to have a slight concavity
> > very near the inside
> > edge of the tip rail. I don't know if this is normal
> > for this model of
> > Dukoff.
> > 
> > Though the inside edge of the tiprail seems to be
> > distinct, could this
> > angle be off slightly and would bringing the
> > baffling down behind the
> > inside edge of the tiprail eliminate the squeeling?
> > I do not know if
> > this mpc has been worked on before I acquired it. I
> > did gauge the side
> > rails and they are pretty even all the way. The
> > table was concave. I
> > brought it almost to flat.
> > 
> > Any help would be appreciated.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >
>

This html message parsed with html2text ---------------------------Have you measured the facing curve with a glass gauge and feelers? You should
really do that, and use the Excel spreadsheets in the Files section to analyze
the curve. What you can see visually on a mouthpiece (the shape of the tip
rail, the thickness of the side rails, the baffle, etc.) is only a small part
of the puzzle.  
  
Dan T  
  
maddahorn wrote:

> thanks for the responses:  
>  
>  Toby, I'm not sure what you mean by maintaining the curve of the lay? Do
> you mean of the Tip rail? If so, I got it to match my reed tip at the
> outside of the tip rail but there is a slight variation in the width of the
> rail along the contour of it's lay...probably +/- .002" from the center to
> the outside where it meets the side rails. Is this enough to cause
> squeeling? I wanted to do as little as possible to this mpce, foregoing the
> possibility of making a mess of the tip rail.Unfortunately sounds like I'm
> going to have to bite the bullet and drop the baffle a bit behind the tip
> rail...scary area for me.  
>  
>  Thanks again all.  
>  
>  \\--- In
> [MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com](mailto:MouthpieceWork%40yahoogroups.com),
> ...> wrote:  
>  >  
>  > I would think that taking some material off just below the  
>  > tip rail could certainly help with the squealing. Really,  
>  > right below the tip rail: make sure that the angle changes  
>  > noticeably at the back edge of the tip rail.  
>  >  
>  > I assume you have tried this with different reeds...An  
>  > unbalanced reed can squeak like crazy on a balanced mpc.  
>  > And even if the side rails are balanced (unbalanced side  
>  > rails are a major cause of this kind of behavior), did you  
>  > maintain the curve of the lay correctly?  
>  >  
>  > Toby  
>  >  
>  > \\--- maddahorn ..> wrote:  
>  >  
>  > >  
>  > > I recently acquired a 5* M Dukoff Bari mpc. After  
>  > > filling and finishing  
>  > > the small ding and gouge and bringing the tiprail to  
>  > > match the existing  
>  > > rail, it squeels. The width is close to 1/32" (.034)  
>  > > . The slight  
>  > > rollover baffle seems to have a slight concavity  
>  > > very near the inside  
>  > > edge of the tip rail. I don't know if this is normal  
>  > > for this model of  
>  > > Dukoff.  
>  > >  
>  > > Though the inside edge of the tiprail seems to be  
>  > > distinct, could this  
>  > > angle be off slightly and would bringing the  
>  > > baffling down behind the  
>  > > inside edge of the tiprail eliminate the squeeling?  
>  > > I do not know if  
>  > > this mpc has been worked on before I acquired it. I  
>  > > did gauge the side  
>  > > rails and they are pretty even all the way. The  
>  > > table was concave. I  
>  > > brought it almost to flat.  
>  > >  
>  > > Any help would be appreciated.  
>  > >  
>  > >  
>  > >  
>  > >  
>  > >  
>  >  
>  
>

Dan has it right. There is a point, about halfway between
the bottom of the window and the tip, where the facing
curve starts. Up to that point, the side rails are in the
same plane as the table--they are flat. Then the curve
begins, so that when they reach  the tip rail they are
something like 1.5-2.5 mm higher compared to where they
started. But that is not a straight line, it is a curve,
and the slope of that curve are very important to how the
reed responds. Two mpcs can have the same tip opening and
play very differently if the curve between the "break" and
the tip are different.

Toby

--- maddahorn <maddahorn@...> wrote:

> thanks for the responses:
> 
> Toby, I'm not sure what you mean by maintaining the
> curve of the lay? Do you mean of the Tip rail? If
> so, I got it to match my reed tip at the outside of
> the tip rail but there is a slight variation in the
> width of the rail along the contour of it's
> lay...probably +/- .002" from the center to the
> outside where it meets the side rails. Is this
> enough to cause squeeling? I wanted to do as little
> as possible to this mpce, foregoing the possibility
> of making a mess of the tip rail.Unfortunately
> sounds like I'm going to have to bite the bullet and
> drop the baffle a bit behind the tip rail...scary
> area for me.
> 
> Thanks again all.
> 
> --- In MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com,
> <kymarto123@...> wrote:
> >
> > I would think that taking some material off just
> below the
> > tip rail could certainly help with the squealing.
> Really,
> > right below the tip rail: make sure that the angle
> changes
> > noticeably at the back edge of the tip rail. 
> > 
> > I assume you have tried this with different
> reeds...An
> > unbalanced reed can squeak like crazy on a
> balanced mpc.
> > And even if the side rails are balanced
> (unbalanced side
> > rails are a major cause of this kind of behavior),
> did you
> > maintain the curve of the lay correctly?
> > 
> > Toby
> > 
> > --- maddahorn <maddahorn@...> wrote:
> > 
> > > 
> > > I recently acquired a 5* M Dukoff Bari mpc.
> After
> > > filling and finishing
> > > the small ding and gouge and bringing the
> tiprail to
> > > match the existing
> > > rail, it squeels. The width is close to 1/32"
> (.034)
> > > . The slight
> > > rollover baffle seems to have a slight concavity
> > > very near the inside
> > > edge of the tip rail. I don't know if this is
> normal
> > > for this model of
> > > Dukoff.
> > > 
> > > Though the inside edge of the tiprail seems to
> be
> > > distinct, could this
> > > angle be off slightly and would bringing the
> > > baffling down behind the
> > > inside edge of the tiprail eliminate the
> squeeling?
> > > I do not know if
> > > this mpc has been worked on before I acquired
> it. I
> > > did gauge the side
> > > rails and they are pretty even all the way. The
> > > table was concave. I
> > > brought it almost to flat.
> > > 
> > > Any help would be appreciated.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > >
> >
> 
> 
> 

I will recheck all measurements. I think the most noticeable area of
concern is the inside edge transition to the baffle. It does seem very
pronounced, for lack of a better term. I'm sure I will have to deal with
this.

thanks all.

f.