Hello all,

I play Tenor but also own an alto, a '56 MKVI. I rarely play it since
the only mpce I had , Dukoff 7*, broke down. Since I buy and sell horns
I've acquired many alto pces left in the case. I messed with a few
vintage pces to get them to play reasonably well but not great - meaning
much more resistance than from my tenor. For the heck of it I put my
VanDoren HR - .110" tip opening -tenor pce on the alto and it fit nicely
but more than anything it blew freely, more than I have ever experienced
b4 with this horn. I think this was the 1st time I enjoyed playing this
horn since I got in '88. Obviously it was not in tune but the free
blowing experience of this setup was great. Is it normal to get
resistance blowing an alto with a good mpce comparitively to a tenor? or
should you be able to experience the same situation with a well finished
alto mpce?

It is normal for the smaller saxes to play best with a firmer embouchure than the larger saxes.  One indication of these embouchures are the pitch targets for playing the mouthpiece alone:

Soprano C
Alto A
Tenor G
Baritone Eb

These are general guidelines attributed to Santy Runyon.  Jazz players often play looser and push in more to compensate.  But this requires more lipping to keep the sax in tune.  

Note that the alto and tenor targets are only a step apart.  So the difference in ideal embouchure support is not huge, but it is noticeable.

Blowing resistance has a lot to do with tip opening, reed choice and facing curve length, shape and quality.

I think it is possible to play alto with a tenor-like embouchure and resistance.  It can sound fatter like a tenor.  A Jackie McLean sound come to mind.
 
Mojo Mouthpiece Work LLC
2925 Crane St., Vineland, NJ 08361 
Paypal to sabradbury79@yahoo.com 
Check out: http://www.mojomouthpiecework.com/




________________________________
From: maddahorn <maddahorn@...>
To: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thu, November 12, 2009 7:51:30 AM
Subject: [MouthpieceWork] Alto Mpce Resistance

  

Hello all,

I play Tenor but also own an alto, a '56 MKVI. I rarely play it since
the only mpce I had , Dukoff 7*, broke down. Since I buy and sell horns
I've acquired many alto pces left in the case. I messed with a few
vintage pces to get them to play reasonably well but not great - meaning
much more resistance than from my tenor. For the heck of it I put my
VanDoren HR - .110" tip opening -tenor pce on the alto and it fit nicely
but more than anything it blew freely, more than I have ever experienced
b4 with this horn. I think this was the 1st time I enjoyed playing this
horn since I got in '88. Obviously it was not in tune but the free
blowing experience of this setup was great. Is it normal to get
resistance blowing an alto with a good mpce comparitively to a tenor? or
should you be able to experience the same situation with a well finished
alto mpce?





      

I agree with much of what Keith says.  the facing schedule, tip opening and reed are big factors regardless of the single reed instrument.  However, I share the following for what it is worth: I play tenor primarily. I had a chance to talk with an alto great, who i will let remain nameless, at a gig the other night about alto mpcs.  I told him that on alto, I use a morgan 7* which has a more resistant feel than any of my tenor mpcs which range from .98 to .115.   He said that a 7* is a "big" tip opening for an alto.  He said, unlike the tenor which will play well with relatively large tip openings, he believes altos are different and that altos play best with a mpc sporting a 5 to 6 tip opening.  Following up on that, I pulled out the 4* yamaha alto mpc that came with my unlacquered yamaha z and i was struck by how strong and large the sound was without using my marine corp abs :) it sang beautifully.  As for the player as a factor on resistance, I can only say, that in attempting to adhere to the Joe Allard school, I do not concsciously change my embouchure for any single reed instrument -- same pressure -- as little as possible, same amount of lip -- as little as possible.  I think this is what Dick Oatts teaches and what Jerry Bergonzi calls this the "anti embouchure."   


mike

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Keith Bradbury 
  To: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2009 9:59 AM
  Subject: Re: [MouthpieceWork] Alto Mpce Resistance


    

  It is normal for the smaller saxes to play best with a firmer embouchure than the larger saxes.  One indication of these embouchures are the pitch targets for playing the mouthpiece alone:

  Soprano C
  Alto A
  Tenor G
  Baritone Eb

  These are general guidelines attributed to Santy Runyon.  Jazz players often play looser and push in more to compensate.  But this requires more lipping to keep the sax in tune.  

  Note that the alto and tenor targets are only a step apart.  So the difference in ideal embouchure support is not huge, but it is noticeable.

  Blowing resistance has a lot to do with tip opening, reed choice and facing curve length, shape and quality.

  I think it is possible to play alto with a tenor-like embouchure and resistance.  It can sound fatter like a tenor.  A Jackie McLean sound come to mind.
   
  Mojo Mouthpiece Work LLC
  2925 Crane St., Vineland, NJ 08361 
  Paypal to sabradbury79@... 
  Check out: http://www.mojomouthpiecework.com/





------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: maddahorn <maddahorn@...>
  To: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com
  Sent: Thu, November 12, 2009 7:51:30 AM
  Subject: [MouthpieceWork] Alto Mpce Resistance

    

  Hello all,

  I play Tenor but also own an alto, a '56 MKVI. I rarely play it since
  the only mpce I had , Dukoff 7*, broke down. Since I buy and sell horns
  I've acquired many alto pces left in the case. I messed with a few
  vintage pces to get them to play reasonably well but not great - meaning
  much more resistance than from my tenor. For the heck of it I put my
  VanDoren HR - .110" tip opening -tenor pce on the alto and it fit nicely
  but more than anything it blew freely, more than I have ever experienced
  b4 with this horn. I think this was the 1st time I enjoyed playing this
  horn since I got in '88. Obviously it was not in tune but the free
  blowing experience of this setup was great. Is it normal to get
  resistance blowing an alto with a good mpce comparitively to a tenor? or
  should you be able to experience the same situation with a well finished
  alto mpce?






  

Nice post Mike.  I think not going large on alto is the more conventional approach and should not be abandoned without giving it a fair shake.  
 
Mojo Mouthpiece Work LLC
2925 Crane St., Vineland, NJ 08361 
Paypal to sabradbury79@... 
Check out: http://www.MojoMouthpieceWork.com