Mouthpiece Work / temperature and refacing
FROM: sigmund451 (sigmund451)
SUBJECT: temperature and refacing
Im not sure if Im loosing my mind or if this is a variable in refacing HR mouthpieces. When I take a moutpiece at a cool room temp, flatten the table and begin the facing I am landing spot on the numbers. Then midway through the refacing the numbers change..i.e I put a facing lentgh of 46...it ends up at 48-50. The same happens at .005 too. As a result several other numbers then of course change. My house is around 65 degrees. Then there is friction and my body temp holding the piece. Has anyone else had this happen or am I just doing something strange? Im not hitting that spot on the facing curve either. I can always stick it in my pocket and warm it but Im wondering if this is the issue. It is somewhat annoying in that it takes time to go back and make things right that once were! Thanks
FROM: railwayreed (Helge Solvang)
SUBJECT: SV: [MouthpieceWork] temperature and refacing
What kind of gage do you use? Is it made from glass or Plexiglas? Are you sure that its not your gage that is getting slightly bend from the temperature of your hand? I had trouble with mine once, I had left it in the sun on my working bench, and when I measured the mouthpiece after some work on it all the numbers were wrong. After a lot of trouble I (unfortunately) had my gage with the outside in when I should measure once again, then I discovered that the gage was slightly curved. After that Im always aware of temperature changes on one of the sides of my gage. Best Helge _____ Fra: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com [mailto:MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com] På vegne av sigmund451 Sendt: 20. april 2008 21:17 Til: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com Emne: [MouthpieceWork] temperature and refacing Im not sure if Im loosing my mind or if this is a variable in refacing HR mouthpieces. When I take a moutpiece at a cool room temp, flatten the table and begin the facing I am landing spot on the numbers. Then midway through the refacing the numbers change..i.e I put a facing lentgh of 46...it ends up at 48-50. The same happens at .005 too. As a result several other numbers then of course change. My house is around 65 degrees. Then there is friction and my body temp holding the piece. Has anyone else had this happen or am I just doing something strange? Im not hitting that spot on the facing curve either. I can always stick it in my pocket and warm it but Im wondering if this is the issue. It is somewhat annoying in that it takes time to go back and make things right that once were! Thanks
FROM: sigmund451 (sigmund451)
SUBJECT: Re: SV: [MouthpieceWork] temperature and refacing
Its a glass Babbitt gage. --- In MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com, "Helge Solvang" <helgsolv@...> wrote: > > What kind of gage do you use? Is it made from glass or Plexiglas? Are you > sure that its not your gage that is getting slightly bend from the > temperature of your hand? I had trouble with mine once, I had left it in the > sun on my working bench, and when I measured the mouthpiece after some work > on it all the numbers were wrong. After a lot of trouble I (unfortunately) > had my gage with the outside in when I should measure once again, then I > discovered that the gage was slightly curved. After that I'm always aware of > temperature changes on one of the sides of my gage. > > > > Best Helge > > > > _____ > > Fra: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com [mailto:MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com] > På vegne av sigmund451 > Sendt: 20. april 2008 21:17 > Til: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com > Emne: [MouthpieceWork] temperature and refacing > > > > Im not sure if Im loosing my mind or if this is a variable in refacing > HR mouthpieces. When I take a moutpiece at a cool room temp, flatten > the table and begin the facing I am landing spot on the numbers. Then > midway through the refacing the numbers change..i.e I put a facing > lentgh of 46...it ends up at 48-50. The same happens at .005 too. As > a result several other numbers then of course change. > My house is around 65 degrees. Then there is friction and my body temp > holding the piece. Has anyone else had this happen or am I just doing > something strange? Im not hitting that spot on the facing curve > either. I can always stick it in my pocket and warm it but Im > wondering if this is the issue. It is somewhat annoying in that it > takes time to go back and make things right that once were! > > Thanks >
FROM: bzalto (John Delia)
SUBJECT: Re: temperature and refacing
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FROM: andrewhdonaldson (andrewhdonaldson)
SUBJECT: Re: temperature and refacing
If it were temperature change and the mp was expanding then wouldn't the measurements be getting smaller? It might be fine dust left over from sanding getting between the facing or table and the glass. I get this sometimes. Best cure is to rinse off the mp in water and let it dry before continuing. Regards, Andrew > > *Fra:* MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com [mailto: > > MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com] *På vegne av* sigmund451 > > *Sendt:* 20. april 2008 21:17 > > *Til:* MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com > > *Emne:* [MouthpieceWork] temperature and refacing > > > > > > > > Im not sure if Im loosing my mind or if this is a variable in refacing > > HR mouthpieces. When I take a moutpiece at a cool room temp, flatten > > the table and begin the facing I am landing spot on the numbers. Then > > midway through the refacing the numbers change..i.e I put a facing > > lentgh of 46...it ends up at 48-50. The same happens at .005 too. As > > a result several other numbers then of course change. > > My house is around 65 degrees. Then there is friction and my body temp > > holding the piece. Has anyone else had this happen or am I just doing > > something strange? Im not hitting that spot on the facing curve > > either. I can always stick it in my pocket and warm it but Im > > wondering if this is the issue. It is somewhat annoying in that it > > takes time to go back and make things right that once were! > > > > Thanks > > > > > > >
FROM: dantorosian (Dan Torosian)
SUBJECT: Re: temperature and refacing
This html message parsed with html2text ---------------------------I also find that grit and dust from sanding are the culprits when readings change like that. I wipe the mouthpiece off constantly while I'm working. I wipe the gauge off frequently also. Dan T andrewhdonaldson wrote: > If it were temperature change and the mp was expanding then wouldn't > the measurements be getting smaller? > > It might be fine dust left over from sanding getting between the > facing or table and the glass. I get this sometimes. Best cure is to > rinse off the mp in water and let it dry before continuing. > > Regards, > Andrew > > > > *Fra:* > [MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com](mailto:MouthpieceWork%40yahoogroups.com) > [mailto: > > > > [MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com](mailto:MouthpieceWork%40yahoogroups.com)] > *Pa vegne av* sigmund451 > > > *Sendt:* 20. april 2008 21:17 > > > *Til:* > [MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com](mailto:MouthpieceWork%40yahoogroups.com) > > > *Emne:* [MouthpieceWork] temperature and refacing > > > > > > > > > > > > Im not sure if Im loosing my mind or if this is a variable in refacing > > > HR mouthpieces. When I take a moutpiece at a cool room temp, flatten > > > the table and begin the facing I am landing spot on the numbers. Then > > > midway through the refacing the numbers change..i.e I put a facing > > > lentgh of 46...it ends up at 48-50. The same happens at .005 too. As > > > a result several other numbers then of course change. > > > My house is around 65 degrees. Then there is friction and my body temp > > > holding the piece. Has anyone else had this happen or am I just doing > > > something strange? Im not hitting that spot on the facing curve > > > either. I can always stick it in my pocket and warm it but Im > > > wondering if this is the issue. It is somewhat annoying in that it > > > takes time to go back and make things right that once were! > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > >
FROM: bzalto (John Delia)
SUBJECT: Re: temperature and refacing
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FROM: stevesklar (Steve)
SUBJECT: Re: temperature and refacing
My biggest issue is putting the glass measuring gauge in the same exact spot both left to right (perfectly straight) and top to bottom after a slip or remeasuring, etc. After all, if you are off top to bottom .005" in it's position, your gauge is going to be off the same amount. The best method i've found it to butt the glass & mpc up against a preknown flat surface to confirm the tip and gauge are matched - and then visually check. Of course, you do have to make sure that you are perpendicular with both too otherwise it will be off. --- In MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com, "sigmund451" <sigmund451@...> wrote: > > Im not sure if Im loosing my mind or if this is a variable in refacing > HR mouthpieces. When I take a moutpiece at a cool room temp, flatten > the table and begin the facing I am landing spot on the numbers. Then > midway through the refacing the numbers change..i.e I put a facing > lentgh of 46...it ends up at 48-50. The same happens at .005 too. As > a result several other numbers then of course change. > My house is around 65 degrees. Then there is friction and my body temp > holding the piece. Has anyone else had this happen or am I just doing > something strange? Im not hitting that spot on the facing curve > either. I can always stick it in my pocket and warm it but Im > wondering if this is the issue. It is somewhat annoying in that it > takes time to go back and make things right that once were! > > Thanks >
FROM: tenorman1952 (Paul C.)
SUBJECT: Re: temperature and refacing
I have to ask... to the people having inconsistent readings...
Are you using zero end gauges or set back gauges?
Paul
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FROM: tenorman1952 (Paul C.)
SUBJECT: Re: temperature and refacing
I wipe the facing and glass gauge each time I measure.
I use a zero end gauge, and align by holding the mouthpiece/glass perpendicular to the vertical edge of my workbench each time.
Paul
Dan Torosian <dtorosian@...> wrote:
I also find that grit and dust from sanding are the culprits when readings change like that. I wipe the mouthpiece off constantly while I'm working. I wipe the gauge off frequently also.
Dan T
andrewhdonaldson wrote: If it were temperature change and the mp was expanding then wouldn't
the measurements be getting smaller?
It might be fine dust left over from sanding getting between the
facing or table and the glass. I get this sometimes. Best cure is to
rinse off the mp in water and let it dry before continuing.
Regards,
Andrew
> > *Fra:* MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com [mailto:
> > MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com] *P� vegne av* sigmund451
> > *Sendt:* 20. april 2008 21:17
> > *Til:* MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com
> > *Emne:* [MouthpieceWork] temperature and refacing
> >
> >
> >
> > Im not sure if Im loosing my mind or if this is a variable in refacing
> > HR mouthpieces. When I take a moutpiece at a cool room temp, flatten
> > the table and begin the facing I am landing spot on the numbers. Then
> > midway through the refacing the numbers change..i.e I put a facing
> > lentgh of 46...it ends up at 48-50. The same happens at .005 too. As
> > a result several other numbers then of course change.
> > My house is around 65 degrees. Then there is friction and my body temp
> > holding the piece. Has anyone else had this happen or am I just doing
> > something strange? Im not hitting that spot on the facing curve
> > either. I can always stick it in my pocket and warm it but Im
> > wondering if this is the issue. It is somewhat annoying in that it
> > takes time to go back and make things right that once were!
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> >
> >
>
Link to Paul's articles from Main page of "Saxgourmet":
http://www.saxgourmet.com
Listen to Paul's MP3's and view saxophone photos at:
http://briefcase.yahoo.com/tenorman1952
Paul Coats is the sole US importer of SAXRAX products from
http://www.saxrax.com
For SAXRAX products, email Paul at saxraxus@...
---------------------------------
Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
FROM: kwbradbury (Keith Bradbury)
SUBJECT: Re: temperature and refacing
I use a set back gage and I use the same eyes to zero it as I trust to read
the feeler measurements. ;)
Once in a while I think I may have a HR mouthpiece that seems to be
changing on me. I think there may be some thermal swelling of the table
that makes the smallest feeler drop in a little farther. But it is also
very easy to mess up the facing length while working near it. So I'm not
convinced one way or another.
Some wood mouthpieces are really bad to work on. About half are stable,
the rest deform with temperature and moisture. I had one I had to reface
"wet" and warm in order for it to play well. When it dried, it did not
measure well, but I left it alone.
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FROM: gregwier (Greg Wier)
SUBJECT: Re: temperature and refacing
The temperature would have to be extreme to affect the results of a mouthpiece job in progress. I also use the set back glass gauge and place a thick feeler gauge at the zero line with the tip of the mouthpiece against it to assure that the mouthpiece is correctly placed for accuracy. My kit also includes a zero at the edge glass but I prefer the set back glass and have used both in tests for accuracy. The readings for both are the same as long as the mouthpiece is assuredly at zero on the set back style glass. ________________________________________________________________________ ___________ > Be a better friend, newshound, and > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ >
FROM: bradbehn (Brad Behn)
SUBJECT: Re: temperature and refacing
This html message parsed with html2text ---------------------------Moisture could be the problem. Condensation from playing or even that of your warm hands touching the cold surface of the hard rubber (especially during humid atmospheric conditions) can cause the glass gauge to float on a thin film of water on the table’s surface. This issue is a little less profound when measuring a facing with a concave table. This issue can be a real problem when measuring a mouthpiece with a convex table. I always like to proof my work by measuring the mouthpiece **dry** and clean. I also agree with the folks who recommend cleaning your tools frequently. Any dust or moisture on your glass gauge or steel feelers will also cause issues. Brad Behn [www.clarinetmouthpiece.com](http://www.clarinetmouthpiece.com) \\--- On **Sun, 4/20/08, sigmund451 __**wrote: > From: sigmund451 > Subject: [MouthpieceWork] temperature and refacing > To: MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com > Date: Sunday, April 20, 2008, 1:17 PM > > Im not sure if Im loosing my mind or if this is a variable in refacing > HR mouthpieces. When I take a moutpiece at a cool room temp, flatten > the table and begin the facing I am landing spot on the numbers. Then > midway through the refacing the numbers change..i.e I put a facing > lentgh of 46...it ends up at 48-50. The same happens at .005 too. As > a result several other numbers then of course change. > My house is around 65 degrees. Then there is friction and my body temp > holding the piece. Has anyone else had this happen or am I just doing > something strange? Im not hitting that spot on the facing curve > either. I can always stick it in my pocket and warm it but Im > wondering if this is the issue. It is somewhat annoying in that it > takes time to go back and make things right that once were! > > Thanks > > > --- * * * Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. [ Try it now.](http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51733/*http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ )
FROM: stevesklar (Steve)
SUBJECT: Re: temperature and refacing
I also use a zero end gauge I also keep a small key brush handy to brush off particles on the table, rails, etc of the mpc and area as I'm working on it. Could also just use a small soft paint brush or soft towel. --- In MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com, "sigmund451" <sigmund451@...> wrote: > > Im not sure if Im loosing my mind or if this is a variable in refacing > HR mouthpieces. When I take a moutpiece at a cool room temp, flatten > the table and begin the facing I am landing spot on the numbers. Then > midway through the refacing the numbers change..i.e I put a facing > lentgh of 46...it ends up at 48-50. The same happens at .005 too. As > a result several other numbers then of course change. > My house is around 65 degrees. Then there is friction and my body temp > holding the piece. Has anyone else had this happen or am I just doing > something strange? Im not hitting that spot on the facing curve > either. I can always stick it in my pocket and warm it but Im > wondering if this is the issue. It is somewhat annoying in that it > takes time to go back and make things right that once were! > > Thanks >