After seeing Merlin today and discussing the above topic I remembered 
I have some numbers that might be interesting...perhaps mouthpiece 
numbers of Franklyn Cohen (Cleveland Orchestra)..... 128 tip   10-8   
18-14    28-24    40-32     Also two facings from Forrest 
mouthpieces...37-35   24-23   12+-12   6-6    another 36-35   24-22   
12+-12   6-6    tip openings 1.05    Any comments?

> 128 tip   10-8   
> 18-14    28-24    40-32        
> Any comments?

eeeeuuuuwwwww.....  He put that thing in his mouth?

Actually it probably just adds some resistance and might be reed 
picky.  He's probably tried others and prefers this.

There are some clarinetists that like assymetrical facings.  They say it 
adds more resistance, which they like. 

Ron Coelho introduces an assymetricity on purpose.  He feels it adds 
"more complex overtones" to the sound.  Ron also has other ideas on 
facings, and makes some rather long, open mouthpieces.  And there are a 
number of very fine players who like what he does, so I certainly cannot 
criticize.

But with some players, they have been playing a particular mouthpiece 
for many years, and like the way it plays, do not want to change.  Then 
some mouthpiece guy (like me) comes along and measures it and says, 
"hey, this thing is crooked."  But the player does not want to "fix" it, 
because he plays well on it now.  And who can argue with that?

But I have also talked to people such as Tom Ridenour, who do want an 
even facing, and even reed, too.  Tom also is convinced, as I am, that 
the best facing curve is an arc of a perfect circle, so that the reed 
meets no bumps or flats as it smoothly curves around the facing to the tip.

Tom also markets his reed balancing system.  This involves some simple 
tools and a tape, and at first some think that it is overpriced for the 
tools involved.  But you are not just buying tools, you are buying a 
taped lesson on how to make your reeds even from side to side, how to 
balance them.

I have long thought about players that could only get one or two reeds 
out of a box to play.  Perhaps their mouthpiece is crooked, and those 
few very unbalanced reeds would be the only ones that would vibrate well 
on the crooked facing.

With a balanced reed, and even facing, you will, I promise you, get much 
more than "one or two good reeds out of a box".  In fact, unless a reed 
is split or chipped, it will almost always play, when balanced as Tom shows.

And I believe, as Tom does, that with an even facing, consistent curve, 
the instrument will play more predictably, respond as expected.

Paul


John Price wrote:

>
> After seeing Merlin today and discussing the above topic I remembered
> I have some numbers that might be interesting...perhaps mouthpiece
> numbers of Franklyn Cohen (Cleveland Orchestra)..... 128 tip   10-8  
> 18-14    28-24    40-32     Also two facings from Forrest
> mouthpieces...37-35   24-23   12+-12   6-6    another 36-35   24-22  
> 12+-12   6-6    tip openings 1.05    Any comments?
>
>
>
>
>
> Got a Mouthpiece Work question?  Send it to MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com
>
> Visit the site at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MouthpieceWork to see 
> the Files, Photos and Bookmarks relating to Mouthpiece Work.
>
> To see and modify your groups, go to http://groups.yahoo.com/mygroups
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>     * To visit your group on the web, go to:
>       http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MouthpieceWork/
>        
>     * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>       MouthpieceWork-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>       <mailto:MouthpieceWork-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>
>        
>     * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
>       Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
>
>

I really prefer even radial curves on saxophones - but I must admit 
that some of the clarinet pieces I've played with non-radial curves 
are excellent. I DON'T like asymmetrical facings though. I agree with 
you and Tom that it makes it really tough to find a reed that works 
well.

I think I may just try some more radial curves on clarinet pieces. 
I've got a large stock of plastic Buffet pieces available to me to 
mess with. I've put a Vandoren M13 curve on a few, and it's worked 
beautifully for some players who wanted an inexpensive backup 
mouthpiece. 


--- In MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com, Paul Coats <tenorman@t...> 
wrote:
> There are some clarinetists that like assymetrical facings.  They 
say it 
> adds more resistance, which they like. 
> 
> Ron Coelho introduces an assymetricity on purpose.  He feels it 
adds 
> "more complex overtones" to the sound.  Ron also has other ideas on 
> facings, and makes some rather long, open mouthpieces.  And there 
are a 
> number of very fine players who like what he does, so I certainly 
cannot 
> criticize.
> 
> But with some players, they have been playing a particular 
mouthpiece 
> for many years, and like the way it plays, do not want to change.  
Then 
> some mouthpiece guy (like me) comes along and measures it and says, 
> "hey, this thing is crooked."  But the player does not want 
to "fix" it, 
> because he plays well on it now.  And who can argue with that?
> 
> But I have also talked to people such as Tom Ridenour, who do want 
an 
> even facing, and even reed, too.  Tom also is convinced, as I am, 
that 
> the best facing curve is an arc of a perfect circle, so that the 
reed 
> meets no bumps or flats as it smoothly curves around the facing to 
the tip.
> 
> Tom also markets his reed balancing system.  This involves some 
simple 
> tools and a tape, and at first some think that it is overpriced for 
the 
> tools involved.  But you are not just buying tools, you are buying 
a 
> taped lesson on how to make your reeds even from side to side, how 
to 
> balance them.
> 
> I have long thought about players that could only get one or two 
reeds 
> out of a box to play.  Perhaps their mouthpiece is crooked, and 
those 
> few very unbalanced reeds would be the only ones that would vibrate 
well 
> on the crooked facing.
> 
> With a balanced reed, and even facing, you will, I promise you, get 
much 
> more than "one or two good reeds out of a box".  In fact, unless a 
reed 
> is split or chipped, it will almost always play, when balanced as 
Tom shows.
> 
> And I believe, as Tom does, that with an even facing, consistent 
curve, 
> the instrument will play more predictably, respond as expected.
> 
> Paul
> 
> 
> John Price wrote:
> 
> >
> > After seeing Merlin today and discussing the above topic I 
remembered
> > I have some numbers that might be interesting...perhaps mouthpiece
> > numbers of Franklyn Cohen (Cleveland Orchestra)..... 128 tip   10-
8  
> > 18-14    28-24    40-32     Also two facings from Forrest
> > mouthpieces...37-35   24-23   12+-12   6-6    another 36-35   24-
22  
> > 12+-12   6-6    tip openings 1.05    Any comments?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Got a Mouthpiece Work question?  Send it to 
MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com
> >
> > Visit the site at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MouthpieceWork to 
see 
> > the Files, Photos and Bookmarks relating to Mouthpiece Work.
> >
> > To see and modify your groups, go to 
http://groups.yahoo.com/mygroups
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------
------
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >     * To visit your group on the web, go to:
> >       http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MouthpieceWork/
> >        
> >     * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> >       MouthpieceWork-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >       <mailto:MouthpieceWork-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?
subject=Unsubscribe>
> >        
> >     * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> >       Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
> >
> >

>>>>I have long thought about players that could only get one or two reeds
out of a box to play.  Perhaps their mouthpiece is crooked, and those few
very unbalanced reeds would be the only ones that would vibrate well on the
crooked facing.<<<<

I agree.  This is one the benefits of an even facing.  If one wants more
resistance, I think there are obetter ways to get it compared to an uneven
facing.

>>>>And I believe, as Tom does, that with an even facing, consistent curve,
the instrument will play more predictably, respond as expected.<<<<

Like Merlin, I found with blind tests that radial (or elliptical) curves
play better on sax than those with flat sections and other irregularities. 
But on clarinet, those with flat sections beat out those with radial
curves.  This bugs me, but I'm sticking with what plays best.

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 

Keith Bradbury wrote:

>
> Like Merlin, I found with blind tests that radial (or elliptical) curves
> play better on sax than those with flat sections and other 
> irregularities.
> But on clarinet, those with flat sections beat out those with radial
> curves.  This bugs me, but I'm sticking with what plays best.


I have thought about this, why clarinet mouthpieces will play with flat 
spots, but not saxophones.  I think it comes down to this... in general, 
saxophones have wider and longer facings, and much larger reeds.  The 
clarinet facings is so short in comparison, and the reed moves such a 
small amount, that these irregularities in facing do not interfere with 
good response as much. 

Paul

>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
> Got a Mouthpiece Work question?  Send it to MouthpieceWork@yahoogroups.com
>
> Visit the site at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MouthpieceWork to see 
> the Files, Photos and Bookmarks relating to Mouthpiece Work.
>
> To see and modify your groups, go to http://groups.yahoo.com/mygroups
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>     * To visit your group on the web, go to:
>       http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MouthpieceWork/
>        
>     * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>       MouthpieceWork-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>       <mailto:MouthpieceWork-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>
>        
>     * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
>       Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
>
>